Curse

JDRyder · May 21, 2009, 10:41 AM // 10:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeydra

Somehow I get the feeling that people don't like HB because it is, well, HB, and are stereotyped against its use.

Agreed, really I think everyone hates the skill because its HB. Imo they need to bring back boon prots in a big way again and kill HB, at least in PVE to brake non-monk "and noob monk" mind sets that its the only monk elite, which is also a reason why I think so many people hate it. Its such a boring build to play and there are so many other builds that are a little harder to master but have a much bigger pay off that non-monks and "noob monks" don't seem to have time for.

They should at least replace the meta with a prot skill so more people "who are too hard headed to learn" will move on and try something other than healing skills. I know not everyone wants to be the "best" at the game but really this HB thing should have been killed a long time ago, its dumbing down the game.

afya · May 21, 2009, 11:32 PM // 23:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by JDRyder

Agreed, really I think everyone hates the skill because its HB. Imo they need to bring back boon prots in a big way again and kill HB, at least in PVE to brake non-monk "and noob monk" mind sets that its the only monk elite, which is also a reason why I think so many people hate it. Its such a boring build to play and there are so many other builds that are a little harder to master but have a much bigger pay off that non-monks and "noob monks" don't seem to have time for.

They should at least replace the meta with a prot skill so more people "who are too hard headed to learn" will move on and try something other than healing skills. I know not everyone wants to be the "best" at the game but really this HB thing should have been killed a long time ago, its dumbing down the game.

Yes, HB is hated b/c its HB
but consider 50% of the time HB = noob
this is what i see today PUGing Against the Charr. (see attach)

not just that 5 heals that scare me.
that monking skill is crazy, using patient+etereal @ 90% health.

Trinity Fire Angel · May 25, 2009, 02:43 AM // 02:43

i think there is nothing wrong with HB personally. I used to be a big WoH fan with my Hybrid WoH build, but then i discovered [Infuse] and can no longer fit prot into my bar - esp when i play Fort Aspen.

My FA / AB build - [Patient Spirit][Dwayna's Kiss][Healer's Boon][Infuse][Mend Condition][Cure Hex][Disciplined Stance][Shield Bash]

Unfortunately there is no room for Heal Party, but i could always throw out the warrior stances and put in Heal Party and GoLE.

Too bad that there is no sufficient conidtion removal other than spotless soul under healing.

maxxfury · May 25, 2009, 03:39 AM // 03:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by afya

not just that 5 heals that scare me.
that monking skill is crazy, using patient+etereal @ 90% health.

Alas, that bar, and others VERY similar are WAY too common, the slightest hint of asking them to take PS in Hardmode....."omg noob i dont need prot, i powerheal! learn2monk!"

The stereotypical pug HB healer...

*tho patient spirit at 90% is fine... if a hit or two is incoming

Div · May 27, 2009, 01:47 AM // 01:47

Healing is a lot more glorious than prot in general. When a person is about to die, they'll notice it when they get healed back to full health. No one notices or cares when they're protted enough so they take no damage.

glacialphoenix · May 27, 2009, 03:26 AM // 03:26

Quote:

Healing is a lot more glorious than prot in general. When a person is about to die, they'll notice it when they get healed back to full health. No one notices or cares when they're protted enough so they take no damage.

People like seeing their own red bars go up, that's true. It's also true that people tend to think of the most obvious solution not as 'more prot' but 'more healing' (or, say, 'more damage'.) I've met people with the mentality that they don't need prot - or, having had prot, assert that they can afford to take more damage, because they ascribe taking less damage to their own abilities.

I've had a couple of friends who actually made that last assertion. "We can take more damage if it helps us kill faster!"

It's pretty *facepalm - dude, you wouldn't be alive to take that extra damage if I didn't prot you in the first place... and even then, you're cutting it perilously close - d'you think Prot Spirit keeps you alive against everything or WHAT?

Brawn Over Brains · Jun 14, 2009, 04:14 PM // 16:14

Because the majority of people are ignorant.
And that's why I h/h <3

tryptamine_xxp · Jun 14, 2009, 05:00 PM // 17:00

most pugs choose hb cause it take little to no iq to see its a suiting elite ... more heal quick response... miam miam :P all i hate is that i could woh and be better than most that struggle to get hb on their bars ,get in group and then say ''gr8.. now how duz i healz''.. i remember 2 years ago i couldnt get group cause i didnt have nf lol kinda made me angry on gw ppl ( not first time ) .. not to mention the mo/ E barrier.. like auspicious incarnation cant even glyph on SOME areas.. again ppl ignore a person possible iq in pugs... so i guess hb to be safe as said before :P

EPO Bot · Jun 14, 2009, 06:59 PM // 18:59

I just used HB again actually. But i try not to get addicted to it.

It's a good build as long as you don't spam HP and run out of juice. And that's what usually goes bad when people use it.

Talania Vulcanclaw · Jun 14, 2009, 07:59 PM // 19:59

Surely it makes more sense in an 8+ man team to have a Prot and a Healer ... People run 2 HB's? Haven't been in a pug team in ages except for a couple of Zquest missions and we used one Prot and one HB. A healers build doesn't really matter to me providing it's effective.

I guess most players want HB because it's the only Monk build they've seen working and like holymasamune says if you get healed right out of the grave they're like "zomg this monk has uber leet monking skillz!" Because skill is staring at red bars and clicking a button when it goes down.

Two HB's though in one team? Meh I would leave. It would just be a fight to see who can heal the next person first lol.

Prevention is better than Cure.

Picuso · Jun 14, 2009, 08:01 PM // 20:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talania Vulcanclaw

Two HB's though in one team? Meh I would leave. It would just be a fight to see who can heal the next person first lol.

I've never been in a party (guildies, alliance or PuG) without 2 HB Monks. No prots, no SY, w/e.

They were a fuc***** hell >_<

laksa and curry · Jun 16, 2009, 08:47 AM // 08:47

Wow thank you everyone for keeping this thread alive. All the points and inputs are valid.

ibtd · Jun 25, 2009, 11:39 AM // 11:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by afya

Yes, HB is hated b/c its HB
but consider 50% of the time HB = noob
this is what i see today PUGing Against the Charr. (see attach)

not just that 5 heals that scare me.
that monking skill is crazy, using patient+etereal @ 90% health.

Love that screenshot, lol. Quite a terrible HB build. Not running Dwayna's Kiss is a crime if you ask me. And Selfless Spirit instead of Healing Ribbon (why Ribbon in the first place when you have HP anyways ? -.-) lifts that bar into another dimension. As long as you don't cast on yourself or hit HP while it's up, you can just redbar for 20-24 seconds for 0 energy if you or your prot is low on energy.

If you have a dedicated and reliable Prot at your side, that bar is fine, even with the res in there... (any other res than UA on a monk, yikes... other group members can run away on time with Rebirth just as well as monks or they can combat res while monks keep healing), if you don't have a prot with you, you need PS.

The problem with HB bars usually is that they don't have enough slots to bring things you need. Seed of Life for example should be on every monk bar (yes, even HB bars) because it is just that good.

Bottom line, HB isn't as bad as some people make it sound, but it's not the solution to all and everything either. When running HB, you pretty much need to coordinate with your monk partners build.

In general, WoH or UA hybrids are better suited for PUGs imho.

bungusmaximus · Jun 25, 2009, 01:40 PM // 13:40

I like infuse for elite missions, healers boon makes monking dumb, hence PUGs like it, because even a really sucky monk can get away with it.

maxxfury · Jun 25, 2009, 01:51 PM // 13:51

Even with a prot monk or another copy of ps in the team, i couldnt deal with not taking PS even on a HB bar. even with a low spec...i mean dropping df by ONE point to bring prot spirit? really isnt a big deal of a couple of hp healed you dont get. its stops them WTFPWN times.

Improvavel · Jul 01, 2009, 04:39 AM // 04:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by maxxfury

stupid double post! PLS DELETE ME MR(S) MODERATOR!

*was laggin like hell and its all gone arse!

If yo go to edit there is an option to delete your own posts. Just before your post there is a box called "Delete this message".

About HB. HB by itself isn't bad. It is decent when paired with a protection monk (maybe boon signet one), but people wont even drop 1 divine favor for a copy of PS. And losing Aegis is annoying too.

Then comes the crap Heal Party - and that is why people like HB - you press a button and everyone is healed as opposed to select someone and press a button, which is loads of thinking and exhausting physical effort. And a monk isn't supposed to spam a 15 energy spell.

I think that this laziness around the duo HB+HP is what gives a bad name to HB.

maxxfury · Jul 01, 2009, 10:53 AM // 10:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Improvavel

If yo go to edit there is an option to delete your own posts. Just before your post there is a box called "Delete this message".

way to fix my brain fart! *thumbs up!

Been able to use a solid heal party ISNT a bad thing tho, yet spamming your blue bar dry with it is.

I think personally HB encourages bad habits from new/bad players, but it isnt in its self a bad build/elite. People just need educating how to play and build bars. but is that gonna happen? not likely, as the majority of the player base wont even read here!! or other places like this!

It doesnt give bar compression BUT can happily!!! spec for a prot spirit and an 8sec~ aegis! and still fit in the big spot heals, party heal and gole, along with the aegis/ps and maybe a cond/hex removal or SoA.

*Still rather run AP :P and get more mileage out of a woh bar

Wish Swiftdeath · Jul 01, 2009, 11:10 AM // 11:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Improvavel

If yo go to edit there is an option to delete your own posts. Just before your post there is a box called "Delete this message".

About HB. HB by itself isn't bad. It is decent when paired with a protection monk (maybe boon signet one), but people wont even drop 1 divine favor for a copy of PS. And losing Aegis is annoying too.

Then comes the crap Heal Party - and that is why people like HB - you press a button and everyone is healed as opposed to select someone and press a button, which is loads of thinking and exhausting physical effort. And a monk isn't supposed to spam a 15 energy spell.

I think that this laziness around the duo HB+HP is what gives a bad name to HB.

Heal party is not crap, it's godly when you know how to use it (much like PS).

If you run out of energy in PvE, either you or your party is terrible.

Zamochit · Jul 01, 2009, 11:12 AM // 11:12

The faster cast time here is the priority rather than the additional healing I think seeing as people can get spiked down so much faster in HM. Also a lot of pugs will bring specific group energy management such as a BiP to aid the HB (and everyone else seeing as in general they are all bad at emanagement) However I am yet to see any semi-competant monk run HB without taking Protective spirit. I understand the need for faster casting in hard mode, but to ignore one of the most potent defensive weapons in the game is laughable.

Improvavel · Jul 01, 2009, 04:51 PM // 16:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zamochit

The faster cast time here is the priority rather than the additional healing I think seeing as people can get spiked down so much faster in HM. Also a lot of pugs will bring specific group energy management such as a BiP to aid the HB (and everyone else seeing as in general they are all bad at emanagement) However I am yet to see any semi-competant monk run HB without taking Protective spirit. I understand the need for faster casting in hard mode, but to ignore one of the most potent defensive weapons in the game is laughable.

BiP is in my opinion a waste of a party slot - its another thing that makes me dislike HB.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wish Swiftdeath

Heal party is not crap, it's godly when you know how to use it (much like PS).

If you run out of energy in PvE, either you or your party is terrible.

I didn't say otherwise. But it is a fact that bad monks/new monks will just start to rely on HP to stay outside enemy range and for any heals. ANd you know that people will do that and that is why most new players/new/bad monks like it.